Rhythm To The Madness is a bandname that is so cool that you feel bad when you abbreviate it. So I didn't. It is also one of the bands that has excited and surprised me the most in the last few years. Not only through their words and music but also due to their unconvential approach to doing the band and the unique vibe around it. Even though I have known Stief and Klaas for years, I still feel like I can't completely grasp what Rhythm To The Madness is all about... There's a lot to be said for bands that can keep that sense of mystery and that have the power to inspire in an age where it sometimes seems like hardcore has become a dumb and painfully predictable circus. It took Klaas a while to answer my questions, but the answers were more than worth the wait. Never Think About The Future, It Comes Soon Enough.So, what was the basic idea behind the band when Stief and you started it? Basically, there was no specific idea behind the band. When I was on tour with Justice & Cold World, Stief and I started talking about how we both wanted to do a band in this style. He wrote some riffs, I wrote some lyrics, and we went from there.
After that tour Stief went to Michiel and recorded the riffs to what would become both demo songs and sent the recordings to me. I adjusted the lyrics to those songs, Stief did a little jam session on these riffs with Daan, and we went into a demo studio to record "Till Your Well Runs Dry" and "Through The Mind’s Eye". Initially we had no plans with the recordings but we liked ‘em so much I figured I’d have some tapes pressed and just sell ‘em on tour with Justice.
Was there a certain attitude you wanted the band to have, a certain message you wanted to convey?Like I said, we never sat down and planned things out with this band. But I guess by just going into the studio without label support or even without the intention to play out live, we showed an attitude that said: fuck it all, we just want to make good music and get things done.
I don’t really have a certain message to convey, I just want to talk about what is important to me personally and what I thinks matters most.
Is Rhythm To The Madness the band that you think hardcore was lacking when you decided to get going?Nah, Rhythm To The Madness is just the band the two of us wanted to do, I really don’t care what music others want to hear. Personally I think Blacklisted is the band hardcore lacked, musically and definitely attitude-wise as well: the way those guys handle their band should be an example for every starting band. Their work ethic, their love for Hardcore, they way they keep going regardless of whatever setbacks cross their path. As a band and as people Blacklisted portrays what Hardcore is all about to me.
Obviously Hardcore can still use a band like Straight Ahead though, but we got the 12” and the videos so I guess we’re good for now...
While it ain't hard to tell some of the bands that have influenced your sound, I would also say that you could evolve in various directions and are not bound to any specific style... Was this something you set out to achieve? How do you think you will develop musically?I guess in some way this was intentional: by not making up a game-plan and thus not laying any restrictions upon ourselves, we created the possibility to go any direction we feel like. We didn’t start out to sound like this or that band, and we didn’t start out to play the world. What everything comes down to with Rhythm To The Madness, is that we had no expectations whatsoever and thus have nothing to lose and everything to gain.
Concerning musical development, I think we can go wherever we want. And we will. The songs we are currently writing are definitely as hard as the EP songs, but they will be more balanced out.
Rhythm To The Madness is Stief and you. What are the pros of doing this band as a 2 man operation and what are the cons? The biggest pro is definitely that we can do exactly whatever we want and how we want it. We don’t have other band-members to consult about music, shirt-designs or artwork. Also, even though we prefer to play out in our studio line-up, we can play with whomever we want and not be a scab band.
The only con I can think of right now is that it’s a hassle confirming shows with this band, but lately we have 3 drummers and 2 bass-players that know the songs so it’s getting easier...
I guess Sike and Daan will be in the band for live shows and recordings as long as they're down to be in it? You also had Cedric playing second guitar at a show a while back, do you feel like Rhythm To The Madness would sound best live as a 5-piece?Yeah, like you said Rhythm To The Madness is just Stief and me, but Sike and Daan obviously are the perfect rhythm section for this band. We try to play as many shows with them on bass and drums, and we definitely need them in the studio. Cedric is playing second guitar for us whenever he can, and I definitely think we sound better as a 5-piece. I hate how the sound collapses when 4-piece bands have guitar solos in their songs. Plus – and you know this – Cete has a great guitar sound and looks fucking hard on stage.
I know that in a lot of ways you think of Rhythm To The Madness as a "metal" band, although I would say it is the type of metal that only real hardcore kids could come up with. What aspect of metal - and exactly what kind of "metal" - is it that you find so appealing that you want to apply it to your band?I know I sometimes say that jokingly but I don’t really see Rhythm To The Madness as a metal band. What I mean by that is that we don’t limit ourselves to Hardcore: not musically and not visually. I usually say that just to make sure people can’t pigeonhole our band as we can draw influences wherever we want.
Honestly there’s not too much in metal that I find appealing, except for the music. I sometimes like the visual aspects of old metal shirts and records but generally speaking I’m not drawn to the subjects they sing about or the imagery they try to create.
As for the kind of metal I like, I’m mostly into the Bay Area Thrash bands: Slayer, Exodus, Testament, Death Angel, Metallica, Possessed, that kind of stuff, and of course I like the East Coast bands too: Nuclear Assault, Overkill, Anthrax, the usual I guess. I obviously like Mötorhead too. I also love Carcass, I never got into their older, more grind stuff, but I think "Heartwork" is sheer perfection. For months I’ve been running an hour everyday with "Heartwork" on the iPod, I ran my sharpest times listening to that album!
The attention to little details such as the barcodes on your demo and 7" (what's up with those anyway?) and the Slayer style credits to whom plays the guitar solos, I guess are part of this whole idea?I don’t know, I just always strive for perfection which is why I’m always worrying and stressing about little details. That’s also why I’m almost never completely happy with anything I do or ever have done. Concerning the solo-credits, I love "Heartwork" and that’s the first album where I noticed these solo credits and thought it was pretty cool. You know: medical handbook lyrics, medical handbook lyrics, lead Steer, lead Amott, lead Steer, medical handbook lyrics, medical handbook lyrics. Pretty cool huh? "Angry With The Sun" also has this kind of credits and I thought that was pretty cool when I was younger.
Lyrically, you dig deeper than most these days and manage to come up with coherent, well written and outspoken lyrics. Clearly, a lot of time and thought goes into that part of the band... How would you describe the way you go about writing lyrics?Well as clichéd as it may sound to me Hardcore is still more than music and I think that this is mainly shown in the way we handle our bands, but also in the lyrics. I still read the lyrics to every record I purchase and if I think the lyrics are weak, the music will have to be twice as good to convince me.
So yes, I put a lot of time and thought into my lyrics, and I appreciate that you think they’re coherent and well written, thank you.
But to answer your question, I don’t really have a consistent way I go about writing lyrics. Most of the time I write down some ideas to work them into a lyric, put them away for a couple of weeks to let ‘em ripe. Then when I read them again, I end up throwing away most of it, only using what I still think is good enough. I repeat this process until I’m completely happy with them or actually most of the time until a deadline is reached. Without deadlines I would keep on changing my lyrics forever.
However, sometimes I work the other way around, for example Stief sent me a rough recording of the riffs and song-structure of what would become "Deliverance From Suffering". I received his email at work, set the volume as quiet as possible cause people walk into my office, and listened to the song while I instantly started writing the words to it.
Furthermore, could you tell me what the two songs, "Soul Doubt" and "Deliverance From Suffering", on the new 7" deal with? I believe "Soul Doubt" is somewhat of a plea for a richer spiritual life rather than an empty one filled with material gain, or am I wrong?In a nutshell, that is what "Soul Doubt" is about indeed. In the first Rhythm To The Madness song I wrote ("Through The Mind’s Eye") I mentioned the words "material ages". In retrospect I figured those were the kind of hollow words used by bands that desperately want to be "a band with a message". I kind of regretted using those words in such a superficial way and therefore decided to elaborate on it by writing "Soul Doubt".
It was a very hard lyric for me to write. I really wanted to write about this topic because it’s something that has been occupying me all my life, but I didn’t want to come off too clever, if you know what I mean? It was hard to write about the subject of material gain without sounding too holier-than-thou, considering I’m far from enlightened myself.
I’m glad that you understand what "Soul Doubt" is about, because we are kinda on the same level on this but that only makes it harder to explain it to others of course. The song is indeed about a richer spiritual life without too much emphasis on material gain, it’s a balance I’ve been struggling to find all my life. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with material gain per se, what matters is the way you prioritise these superficial things in your life. I see no wrong in surrounding yourself with objects that you feel good around: you create a positive environment for yourself, a shelter in which you feel good, a refuge that allows you to recharge your batteries once in a while. I don’t think you can enrich your spiritual life on batteries running low. For some of us these material objects may be records, high tech electronics, books or whatever… As long as people maintain their balance and don’t lose focus of what really matters in the end, I don’t think there’s something wrong with a certain level of material gain.
The song "Deliverance From Suffering" is somewhat harder to explain because we actually just put it on the EP as B-Side song and it’s totally taken out of context. We originally just wanted to do a one sided vinyl single, but Powered Records wanted us to record some B-Side songs, so we decided to put "Deliverance From Suffering" on the EP too.
What I mean by that song being taken out of its context, is that "Deliverance From Suffering" is the prequel to a song that we will record for our upcoming LP. That song is called "Into Tranquillity", of which a stripped down instrumental version (called "Intro Tranquillity") can be found on our EP. The lyrics to both songs will explain themselves once put together, so I won’t give away too much, but allow me to just explain the second part of both verses: "Chewed by the jaws of life - Soul survivors of struggle and strife - An award of sorrow drawing near -
Fear its coming but it’s already here".
We claim to control our own lives, yet we are being lived: we don’t live our lives, our lives live us. We don’t make our own choices, we are influenced and affected by the choices of others: we are being chewed by the jaws of life. To grow into our own strong (or weak) personalities, we (our souls) have been through so much struggle and strife; some people’s struggles more intense than others when compared but equally important in the growth of the person. We constantly try to shake off whatever molds society casts us into and whatever molds we cast others into, yet at the same time we feel uncomfortable when we don’t fit in. It’s a struggle with ourselves more than anything… Obviously it’s more a process than a downright struggle. This struggle is something we prepare for all our lives, it’s something that we foresee in the future: we tell ourselves it’s going to happen one day but for now we’ll just keep avoiding it... Well, the process is right now and it’s portrayed in every decision we make and every word we say. It’s not something that happens or is going to happen, it’s something that IS.
The only way attain a state tranquillity is by delivering ourselves from all suffering. Do people really want to read this?
You've been doing bands for a number of years now, yet I feel as if this is the first time you've truly found yourself, lyrically and vocally. What do you think? How does Rhythm To The Madness differ from the bands you were in before? Were there any mistakes you made in the past you wanted to avoid this time around?I gotta say I agree with you: I indeed truly found myself for the first time.
I think there’s two huge differences between Rhythm To The Madness and any past bands that I did, the most important being growth, which I guess is quite logical as I was 15 years old when I first started doing bands, and I’m 25 years old now.
The other difference between Rhythm To The Madness and any of my past bands is that I always tried to form a band with people I was friends with, therefore resulting (and I’ve said this before) in a compromise between the four or five members that form it. You are always limited by eachother’s musical taste, technical skills and musical creativity, no matter how well you get along.
With Rhythm To The Madness, I wanted this band to have the sound and image that I had in mind, without having to compromise with anybody. Stief is the only person (as a friend and as a musician) that is on the exact same level as me concerning Rhythm To The Madness, so that’s why I didn’t want to bring anybody else in. And that’s why I think I – as you describe it - truly found myself with this band.
Now that the 7" has been out for a while, do you still listen to it once in a while? Is there anything that you think could've been better? Yeah I still listen to it sometimes, there’s a lot of things I think could’ve been better, but like I said: I always strive for, but never get near, perfection so I’m never completely happy with anything I do. To be able to answer your question I just listened to the single again and I gotta say, considering the fact that we wrote those songs on the Justice/Blacklisted tour, with Stief playing acoustic guitar, Daan drumming on his lap and me whispering the lyrics, I think everything came out quite well.
A few months back you did a short UK tour with Cold World. How did those shows go? Do you feel as if the crowd that would come out to see Cold World would also be the type of crowd that would dig Rhythm To The Madness? How does being on tour with your own band compare to being the road dawg for Justice or True Colors f.i.?Keeping in mind those shows were actually some of the first real Rhythm To The Madness shows, I think that they went pretty good. It took us a couple of shows to really feel eachother on stage, especially since we played with a stand-in drummer on that tour, but I think everything worked out fine. I don’t know if the Cold World fans dug us but we got a fair amount of response, even though our record had only just come out at the time and hadn’t gotten around by then.
I love being a road dog! In 2007 I think I must’ve spent a total of 8 weeks on the road with Justice, and I loved every minute of it. As a road dog the only things to worry about are "Do I have enough change when selling merch?" and "When can I try and catch some sleep with all these overnight drives?".
It had been a while since I'd gone out on the road with a band of my own, and I gotta say I had forgotten the stress, pressure and effort that comes along with it. Luckily I had a carefully selected Road Crew of Soul Survivors put together, consisting out of experienced coremen that more than earned their stripes out on the road. So I didn’t have to stress too much and all worked out fine.
Another thing I've noticed is how you don't say much during your live set. You stick to saying the band's name and mentioning the song titles. No thank you's or explanations. Is there any reasoning behind this?There’s no reasoning behind this really, it’s just that I’m not much of a talkative person. It’s hard enough for me to verbally put together a meaningful and coherent sentence, let alone when it’s not in my mother tongue. Plus I figure if people really want to know what I've got to say, they’ll read the lyrics or come up to me and ask. Or do an interview.
And the people I am grateful to, they know that as I thank them in person. If you’re looking for a shoutout through a PA-system, you picked the wrong show. And the wrong band.
Please share with me your insights and ideas on the following:Force Of Words Zine - when's the next issue? At one point I had the fourth issue almost completely finished but in the end decided to throw it all away. However a new fourth issue is in the works and will be released as Complex Man Fanzine #4, out on January 1st 2012.
Mic stand - blessing or curse? Those things are set out to self-destruct all the time! "We need another mic stand up here okay?!".
"Crush The Demoniac" - most violent song ever? Obviously my "powersong" when running!
Kindred "File 01" - you're moshing? Definitely. Packo and I listened to this record on a True Colors weekend-trip the other week, good times. I still vividly remember the first time I heard this album: December '96, I was in boarding school and I came home for Christmas Holidays. I arrived at my parents’ house and a package from Good Life Recordings was waiting for me. I opened it up and found the Kindred CD and a "Proud To Be Drug Free" sweater inside. I immediately put on the CD on my parents’ stereo and before I knew it I threw on my new hoodie and started moshing in the living room. Ofcourse only minutes later my mom came in and saw me moshing (well, you know... "moshing"), normally I would’ve been embarrassed but that time I didn’t care because this record was so good I knew my mom would understand…
Geert Hollanders - fav. quotes? He actually sent me the best text message the other day, just plain coolness in like 8 words. Too bad it’s not meant for publication, so I’ll go for this: "Hardcore shows zijn geen kiekenkot!". Or when we were on a weekend trip with Loud And Clear and some girlfriends came along: "I feel like we’re on a schooltrip". Or the other day when Flip and I were talking about how much we like Guns 'N' Roses "Appetite For Destruction": "To avoid all that weirdo shit is exactly why I got into Hardcore”. So much good stuff, but most of it needs to be kept within the inner circle... "Dutje doen op de zetel hé man".
Last of all, what records/bands have excited you lately? Anything else you want to add?I’ve been more than excited about the new True Colors and Justice records, both bands have taken European Hardcore to a new level in the past and continue to do so with their new records. I also listened to the new Blacklisted LP three times in a row when running the other day, can’t wait to hold that one in my hands. Also can’t wait for the new Cold World LP to drop! It’s been out for a while now, but I’m still listening to the Bitter End LP a lot. I heard some songs of the new Reactionaries record yesterday and that sounds amazing, be on the lookout for their 12” to drop on Deranged Records! Other than those I pretty much stuck to my regulars lately: a steady diet of Rollins Band. Oh and the Invasion LP (from Spain) is fucking great too, but that record is probably way too hard for people that have an internet connection so I guess your readers can’t handle it.
Nothing much to add, I wanna apologise for taking ages to complete this interview but my life’s been hectic as you know. Shout outs to Powered Records, Stadsomvaart 134, and obviously to all the Soul Survivors: Stief, Sike, Daan, Cete, Geert, Peers, Flip The Switch, den Backtrack, Gert SSDshirt, Erik Tilburg, Jeffrey, Hingie, Packo, Jigs and of course you Bjorn!
Rhythm To The Madness – March 25th 17h02
FORTUNA, INFORTUNA, FORTI UNA!
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